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Thread: Why the divide

  1. #46
    Senior Member Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21bubba View Post
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    Well, I got the exact responses from exactly who I thought I would. All is well on PDF.
    God bless us every one.

    PDF is a very solid forum with a very intelligent membership able to think for themselves for the most part. And the courage to call a spade a spade instead of simply following the herd.

    I'm proud to be a, part of the membership here.
    Odd how most folks who say they support the Constitution as written ,,,,,,,,,,,,really don't.

  2. #47
    Senior Member Nakyak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21bubba View Post
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    Well, I got the exact responses from exactly who I thought I would. All is well on PDF.
    So did we

  3. #48
    Senior Member Arejay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMcPhe44 View Post
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    Bad cop good cop? In the eyes of the beholder, but of course our blanket statements generally rule here. Thinking LE can never have suspicions and question someone based on those suspicions is as ridiculous as saying LE should be able to question someone based on nothing more than their skin color or hairstyle and being in the wrong neighborhood.

    Some of us want to give LE very broad powers to keep our neighborhoods safe and some of us want them to stay out of sight until a crime is committed, and some want them to fall somewhere in the middle and be both watchers who sometimes become watchdogs and prevent a serious crime from occurring, which would require some kind of telepathic powers on their part to know when to become the dog.

    Those who can't see that LE, while not perfect, is still a better choice than anarchy, are not being fair to the LEOs who are actually trying to be good cops. Blaming LE for bad laws is like blaming spoons for being fat. The law the OP brings up is a bad law and I agree that a good cop would recognize that and ignore the violation. However if the LEO who made that stop had a BOLO for a similar vehicle or a matching description then he used a bad law to investigate what might be a serious crime.

    At that point I would make the judgement on whether the LEO was a good cop or a bad cop based on his interaction with me. No doubt we have some terrible LEOs but I think it is wrong to blame "all of them" for bad laws, which the people are responsible for, that they use to identify more serious violations and take serious offenders off of the streets.

    The bottom line is that yes some of these actions exceed the limits of the COTUS and the people should correct that, but at the same time some of these actions have netted serious criminals, saved lives, and put violent offenders in jail.

    Some people support this some people don't. I can see both sides of it and agree it could become dangerous to our Republic unless tightly controlled.

    https://fox59.com/2017/10/23/drug-ar...drug-activity/
    “Just about every one of our low level possession cases, is the result of a traffic stop,” Cooper said. “Those are probably literally a thousand arrests a year that come traffic stops in Johnson County.”

    Neither Cox nor Cooper say officers are being more aggressive in making traffic stops, but they agree that more traffic stops are leading to arrests as a result of more individuals carrying illegal drugs or paraphernalia in cars.

    At the same time, officers must also be careful to make sure they have justifiable reason to pull a driver over so a solid drug bust doesn’t get thrown out in court for lack of probable cause, Cooper said.

    “It’s a constant review of what our courts are telling us is legal and not legal,” Cooper said. “And we are in constant communication with police officers to let them know what they can and can’t do and what they should be doing.”
    I was driving my long haired crew member into town in a five hundred dollar boat truck to get his license and than to make the tide. We were both pretty scruffy at the time of the interaction. I'm respectful and cooperative. I don't want or need to hear what a cop thinks of my profession or what he thinks of my crew member. That's why I thought it was an act. But it wasn't. That's what he thought. That's what he said. That was the look on his face. We were pretty much stereotyped and then stopped. LOL. And you know what ? He was so disappointed not to find drugs in my truck , but there's always that other guy . Some people just hate life. Just saying.

  4. #49
    Senior Member BMcPhe44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost1958 View Post
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    Your first sentence.

    If a cop had a reasonable, articulable, reason to suspect a crime has been, is being, or about to be, committed and stops, detains and question a person he's fine.

    If however he just stops a person on some vague "how do I know your not going to commit a crime gut feeling power trip hot wash, he's a bad cop, made a illegal stop, breaking the law himself.

    As to traffic stop drug busts see how many of those resulted in civil forfeiture of the vehicle, etc.
    Standard pretty much in many states is stop for no reason, request to search, bring in drug dog, signal dog to alert if he doesn't , plant some evidence, size vehicle and cash, usually without charging the person.
    All of the instances I listed were stops made for minor traffic violations. I agree some of those laws are stupid but the people’s elected represenitives are responsible for those not LEOs.
    “Civil Wars happen when the victimized are armed. Genocide happens when they are not.”
    ― A.E. Samaan

  5. #50
    Senior Member Ghost1958's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMcPhe44 View Post
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    All of the instances I listed were stops made for minor traffic violations. I agree some of those laws are stupid but the people’s elected represenitives are responsible for those not LEOs.

    The Leo using the stupid law as an excuse to check something out IE, go fishing , is responsible for his own actions.

    He's not required to use a, dumb law as an excuse to go on a fishing trip.

    I've not been stopped in several yrs.

    But my pat response has grown to be " why did you stop me? Write the ticket or let me go. End of discussion.

    It's none of the officers business where I've been, where I'm going, if I'm armed, blah blah.

    Either write the ticket if it's a legit stop or stop bothering me.

    Haven't had any tickets in 20 yrs.
    Odd how most folks who say they support the Constitution as written ,,,,,,,,,,,,really don't.

  6. #51
    Senior Member NONAME762's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LimaCharlie View Post
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    Most people unknowingly break laws every day, but are not called on it. I was stopped by a cop for running a yellow light. He explained to me that Oregon is the only state where running a yellow light is illegal. I was through the light before it turned red, but he decided I could have stopped. Yet the same police force stands down for antifa, blm, or anarchists protests.
    I had a serious problem the first time I read your post. My problem was not with you. My problem was with the cop and the way he read/interpreted the Law. That and the Oregon cops to my way of thinking are on the wrong side of Freedom.
    Come January 20th 2017 there be a New SHERIFF hereabouts Yehaaaaa
    How much nuffin could a dindu do if a dindu dindu nuffin?

  7. #52
    Senior Member NONAME762's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost1958 View Post
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    But my pat response has grown to be " why did you stop me? Write the ticket or let me go. End of discussion.

    It's none of the officers business where I've been, where I'm going, if I'm armed, blah blah.

    Either write the ticket if it's a legit stop or stop bothering me.

    Haven't had any tickets in 20 yrs.
    Since 1994 I've gotten 2 tickets. In 94 I did something really stupid and got a ticket. I deserved it. The ticket was the easy part. In 2015 I went out after dark and after midnight. Broke 2 of the Stupid Rules. Ain't repeated that mistake since. Been careful when needed and ain't been Stupid since.
    Come January 20th 2017 there be a New SHERIFF hereabouts Yehaaaaa
    How much nuffin could a dindu do if a dindu dindu nuffin?

  8. #53
    Senior Member Siam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21bubba View Post
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    Well, I got the exact responses from exactly who I thought I would. All is well on PDF.
    Why would you expect different responses from PDF members that have already expressed an opinion on a topic LOL. I mean, would it make you happier if a person changed thier stance on a topic every time so you would have something different to read?

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